No folks, sorry to disappoint those slobbering pure testosterone all over their keyboard just at the sight of those first three letters. I’m not talking about the bashful, diminutive (yet pert) contents of a 32A cup; much as I admire the mammary gland in all of its varied guises.

No, I’m talking about the naming of poems.

So, you’ve slaved for hours (seconds even) over your perfect sonnet or sestina and it’s nearing the time to launch it on an, until now, ignorant and unsuspecting world. There’s just one ritual left to perform; the vessel is straining at its massive chains, the vast crowd looks skyward in reverence and awe, you stand there champagne bottle poised as the moment is upon you:

“I name this poem . . . “

But what? How does one go about naming a poem? Is it instinctive? Does, in some cases, the name come before the writing? Is the name already a part of the poem? How much thought do you give the process? Does it make any difference?

If one scrolls down the main blog page of our beloved WOL at a reasonable pace (go on, admit it, you’ve all done it just to get quickly down to your new offspring and see how many congratulations you’ve had in those first five minutes since the birth!) All you will see in that blur are titles, in that fetching shade somewhere between cyan and turquoise (what exquisite taste!) And as they pass you speed-read them – at least I do.
So, which are the ones you stop to read? The quirky? The artistic? Those, which hint at either mild amusement - or the illicit aroma of the erotic thrill?

A title can convey all those and more. The title is the window display of your poem; either a wholesome pyramid of those polished red apples - which look almost too good to be real, or a sultry, peroxide tart in laddered fishnets, sucking provocatively on a Gauloises in the Place Pigalle. What would tempt you in?

I feel that it goes without saying that some titles are so commonplace as to be off-putting to many potential readers. How many poems are there entitled simply “Spring” or “My Cat?” Let’s face it; one is hardly likely to be trampled in the stampede to read further. The poem itself may well be a literary triumph of Shakespearean magnitude, but if the title doesn’t get you through the door then both you and the poet will never know.

So the title is important, as signpost, introduction and, perhaps, for relocating the poem at some future date.

It might be worth thinking about what title would entice you to read a poem, or those titles that have stayed in your head for all those years. If they worked on/for you then the same strategy is likely to work for others. Short or long? Relevant or more obscure? What is likely to motivate a potential reader to cross that threshold? Curiosity is a fairly good one I suppose – seeing as how we are all naturally nosey - intrigue your reader with something not immediately obvious. If you are writing light/comic verse you may want to hint at this by having a humorous title – pun or play on words for instance; a hint a the guffaws and belly-laughs (hopefully) to come.
If you are really stuck you can always consult the great Google and the www. (I did and it came up with this):

http://www.ehow.com/how_2136658_develop-title-poem-song.html

Although somehow I don’t imagine myself ever finding a use for the recommended, stunningly original and creatively grammatical "Rare, A Friend Like You." I think most of us would be able, with a little effort, to stretch our imaginations just that little bit further.

So what were the titles that inspired you to read further? Which do you admire and why? What are your thoughts and tips on titling? Why not post and share them on this thread – with its highly innovative and original title? (See, neat trick isn’t it!)

In closing I thought I might just mention what is perhaps a rare exception to the rule, and incidentally one of those poems I would have swapped a Euro Millions winning ticket to have written.

The title hints at perhaps the most mundane and inauspicious subject matter imaginable. And yet . . . and yet there is that inexplicable curiosity factor implicit within. Surely no one would write a poem about that? How could they? What is it really about? And . . . suddenly that bell on a spring is tinkling as you open the door to the literary delight that lies within.

For those of you unfamiliar with this work, immerse, admire, enjoy.

http://www.thepoem.co.uk/poems/mahon.htm

Hi A -

I’m always swayed towards the comments attributed to one of my favourite poets, Billy Collins, whenever people mention or begin to discuss the titles in their poetry. He said, in true Collins style,

“Stepping from the title to the first lines is like stepping into a canoe. A lot of things can go wrong…”

He’s right, of course. More often than not, some titles and their wording are the only real clue to any hidden meaning or allusion buried within the poetry, and titles are often deserving of a much greater value than we actually afford them - rather like Nurses...and poets.

Hi Anthony

What an interesting topic - you'll get a response on this.

For me it is instinctive. I'm fiddling around with the words and suddenly 'click' the title is there and feels right. Never have to give it a moment's thought. If that explains poor titling, so be it.

Thank you for pointing out Derek Mahon's poem - absolutely brilliant.

You enclose a link to some guidance. It includes the words
"The word "friend" should probably be within the title".
Presciently, I posted one on Sunday called 'To a Friend' so appear to have got at least that right.

This reminds me of one of my daughters at school who had to write an essay on "Do Not Judge A Book By It's Cover". She went on to describe how she always chose a book by its cover and got a very poor mark and comments. Its true though, the title allows us to judge the subject, the writer; is it clever, pithy, too clever, aggressive, welcoming, funny. The range of emotions. As I have said before with the number of blogs to scroll down the title and first two visible lines are decision makers for opening the poem, whatever its faults. Creative titles are fab but then if every one used them the statement two word titles would stand out, which can sometimes look dull. The owner of the title should therefore judge the mood of the other titles available and be creative but he/she may need to judge the mood of the readers too. Its a tricky area!Interesting

You're right, Anthony, the title is so important - something I've only belatedly realised. The trouble is that when (I think) I've finished a poem I'm pretty much spent, and with no creative energy left to think about a title. (For me, the title never comes first). So the best thing is to come back to it later, if you can, and if you're lucky. I once wrote a little poem about a railway buff obsessively hunting for traces of old, disused lines and called it The Railway Detective, which would of course immediately put off anyone with a hatred of trainspotters. Then I stumbled upon a photograph of that trackside warning: Stop, Look, Listen, and realised that not only did I have my title, but I felt much better about the poem as well. Your example of Derek Mahon's A Disused Shed in Co Wexford is a great instance of a title appearing so mundane that you simply have to investigate further.

Well, when I read the title of Billy Collins's work - titled...

"Reading An Anthology Of Chinese Poems Of The Sung Dynasty, I Pause To Admire The Length And Clarity Of Their Titles"

For me, this says it all. It has wit, a sense of irony and when you take it in the context of his other work, where his titles are often minimal (but precise), it goes a long way to satisfying his own observation about climbing into a canoe! And, the poem that follows it goes on to describe the importance of 'titles'...

It seems these poets have nothing
up their ample sleeves
they turn over so many cards so early,
telling us before the first line
whether it is wet or dry,
night or day, the season the man is standing in,
even how much he has had to drink.

Maybe it is autumn and he is looking at a sparrow.
Maybe it is snowing on a town with a beautiful name.

"Viewing Peonies at the Temple of Good Fortune
on a Cloudy Afternoon" is one of Sun Tung Po's.
"Dipping Water from the River and Simmering Tea"
is another one, or just
"On a Boat, Awake at Night."

And Lu Yu takes the simple rice cake with
"In a Boat on a Summer Evening
I Heard the Cry of a Waterbird.
It Was Very Sad and Seemed To Be Saying
My Woman Is Cruel--Moved, I Wrote This Poem."

There is no iron turnstile to push against here
as with headings like "Vortex on a String,"
"The Horn of Neurosis," or whatever.
No confusingly inscribed welcome mat to puzzle over.

Instead, "I Walk Out on a Summer Morning
to the Sound of Birds and a Waterfall"
is a beaded curtain brushing over my shoulders.

And "Ten Days of Spring Rain Have Kept Me Indoors"
is a servant who shows me into the room
where a poet with a thin beard
is sitting on a mat with a jug of wine
whispering something about clouds and cold wind,
about sickness and the loss of friends.

How easy he has made it for me to enter here,
to sit down in a corner,
cross my legs like his, and listen.


Now THAT'S poetry!

Kingsley Amis suggests that titles reveal the sex of the writer also did this poem lead to Making Cocoa for Kingsley Amis by Wendy Cope which is more of a title than a poem. I think I have more titles than poems.

A Bookshop Idyll
by Kingsley Amis

Between the GARDENING and the COOKERY
Comes the brief POETRY shelf;
By the Nonesuch Donne, a thin anthology
Offers itself.

Critical, and with nothing else to do,
I scan the Contents page,
Relieved to find the names are mostly new;
No one my age.

Like all strangers, they divide by sex:
Landscape near Parma
Interests a man, so does The Double Vortex,
So does Rilke and Buddha.

'I travel, you see', 'I think' and 'I can read'
These titles seem to say;
But I Remember You, Love is my Creed,
Poem for J.,

The ladies' choice, discountenance my patter
For several seconds;
From somewhere in this (as in any) matter
A moral beckons.

Should poets bicycle-pump the human heart
Or squash it flat?
Man's love is of man's life a thing apart;
Girls aren't like that.

We men have got love well weighed up; our stuff
Can get by without it.
Women don't seem to think that's good enough;
They write about it,

And the awful way their poems lay open
Just doesn't strike them.
Women are really much nicer than men:
No wonder we like them.

Deciding this, we can forget those times
We sat up half the night
Chockfull of love, crammed with bright thoughts,
names, rhymes,
And couldn't write.

I love the discussion thread Anthony – to my knowledge one that hasn’t been done to death before…

To me the title of a poem is very important, though it wouldn’t stop me from reading the work of a poet I know is good. In fact I can think of more than one poet who sometimes has unimaginative titles but writes really good stuff. I guess if you were trawling through reams of unknowns, the title might sway you one way or the other in whether to continue.

Very often I come up with a title before I do the poem. Someone says something in conversation and ping – it’s like a light bulb switching on – a title and a poem begging to be written.

Sometimes I change the title as I go along, thinking of a better one later, as my thought processes and the poem has changed shape. I end up with a word document that has a different title to the original poem.

I quite like titles that mean one thing but another once you have read the poem – a little twist that adds to the theme. Titles that are too long winded lose my attention unless they are purposefully so and therefore humouress.
Much like endings, beginnings are so important.

I find E Dowd’s contribution interesting. Do women write differently to men – lay it out on a plate?
They certainly like to write about love or the loss of it, perhaps being less fearful of expressing emotions.
Analysing my own work, I admit that a good number of my poems are telly rather than showy. Not sure if that is down to my personality rather than my sex! I like to think that I am capable of writing on themes other than love though and I do see male poets capable of expressing emotion. I guess it depends on how in touch men are with their feminine side and whether it bothers them to show that…

"I end up with a word document that has a different title to the original poem."

Quite right, Isobel, it happens to me a lot, too. And it's the devil's own job trying to find it again!

when I first got a computer everything had a similar title: document 1, document 2, doc...

Is there a poem in that?

I also think that a poem's title should be like a key (or a bunch of keys) that may (or not) unlock the real sentiments of a piece of work. Sometimes the title may be obvious "from a train" is simply an observation from a train window. Green Park Eleven was simply an observation one recent Sunday, but not at 11am, the eleven was a reference to the fact that each line contained eleven syllables.
I also wrote a poem for a lovely couple who were getting married on the beach in Hawii entitled "Undersea Dawn". It was read out during their ceremony but to this day Andrew and Sue have not spotted the anagram.
Titles should be mischievous, mysterious and malevolent sometimes but should always make the reader think and focus.

Hi guys, this is my first post on the forum so go easy on me. I find the best way for an attention grabbing title is to make a silly pun that is loosly based on something to do with the poem's content. The more ridculous the better. It can often mask the poem's serious subject matter, or just mock it. Just a device I like to employ.

That is just my tuppence worth on the subject!

<I find the best way for an attention grabbing title is to make a silly pun that is loosly based on something to do with the poem's content.>

To me, that would be the best guarantee that the poet deserves a wet halibut around the chops.

Surely that should be a wet halibut around the chips? ....

.....ok ... I'll get me coat.

Cx

That was one of the more interesting threats I have received in my life. Especially from a self styled oracle of verse such as yourself.

LOL - I wouldn't take it seriously - he's like that with everyone!

I had noticed from trawling the message boards. Very Brian Sewell-esq.

Peter, it seems your heartfelt plea for a "gentle" initiation to the discussion threads went unanswered.

I would caution you against trifling with the sinister Mr Waling. (Heart of stone, fists of iron - and a knob of butter.)

Can we now look forward to the edifying spectacle of halibut(s)? at dawn? Ooh I do hope so! I've not seen anything like that since the Python "Fish Slapping Dance."

Has to be a good title in there somewhere . . .

Regards,
A.E.

Potential new discussion thread. If you were in a fight to the death and could be armed only with a fish, what type of fish would it be? A halibut would not be my first choice.

P.S I will heed your warning. My half hearted plea for leniency was dismissed in spectacular fashion. A lesson has been learnt. Admittedly my initial post was typed with tongue firmly in cheek. Seems that someone to the bait…(end of fish based metaphors.)

<quote>That was one of the more interesting threats I have received in my life. Especially from a self styled oracle of verse such as yourself.</quote>

Glad to be of service, old bean.

I'm all for the excrutiating pun myself; but used in moderation. I believe it's up for discussion at the UN Commission on Dangerous Weapons. It could be banned.

Hi Everyone,

And thanks for all your fascinating and valued contributions. It seems quite unusual these days on the discussion threads to be talking about poetry. Of course, any further contributions are most welcome.

I'm just off to the library to pick up my ordered copy of J.R. Hartley's "A Guide to the History of Piscatorial Armoury." Anyone fancy a Shad?

Regards,
A.E.

"I'm all for the excrutiating pun myself; but used in moderation. I believe it's up for discussion at the UN Commission on Dangerous Weapons. It could be banned."

Political correctness gone mad.

"Potential new discussion thread. If you were in a fight to the death and could be armed only with a fish, what type of fish would it be?"

Pollocks - a load of Pollocks...

that way, you can squeeze in a little pun - just for the sake of annoyance.

LOL
I am not one for fighting, but I wouldn't mess around... Piranah ; )

It is nice to see Mr D Thomas getting into the spirit of things.

For the record. My choice would be a Swordfish/Marlin. No puns intended, a purely practical reason.

Tuna -

because you can tune a piano but you can't tuna fish.

Electric eel would be my choice.

I feel my approach would warrant a degree of underhanded subtlety - a la ninja. Invite all those people you don't really like around for a hot-tub party - then drop a few of these little blighters into the tub . . .

http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/92428/candiru

Ouch!

Regards,
A.E.

I'm not THAT impressed Anthony, what does it do...?

"Once in the passage, it erects the short spines on its gill covers and may thereby cause inflammation, hemorrhage, and even death to the victim".

My ex-wife could do all that - without even leaving the house.

A sperm whale and a coffe blender - I'd poison him with his own testostertone...

Sperm Whale? That's a no-no - it's a mammal.

Ok clever clogs - I'm changing the rules - want to fight about it?

It survives in water and it has the shape of a fish, so it will be my weapon, along with a sword fish and a smelly kipper...

"Cry haddock, and let slip the dogs of war!"

That would be "let slip the dogfish of war..."

Sheesh, doesn't anyone know their Shakespollock any more?

"It survives in water and has the shape of a fish..."

Bloody hell Isobel - you didn't know my ex-wife as well, did ya!?


right... where's that old nuclear warhead in the shape of a fully inflated puffer-fish - this ends right HERE.

On the subject of the smelly kipper, the authority Hartley informs us that:

"The smelly kipper is the equivalent of the Derringer pistol in terms of weaponry. Its diminutive size and ease of concealment make it a favoured choice of the female assassin. It is not unusual to find one secreted in a demure and unassuming handbag - or, more often, lacy undergarments."

I think I know what he means . . .

Perhaps you should revert to being more of a blow fish then Anthony...

Darren - you are a modern day equivelant to Bernard Manning - I'd love to hear what your poor maligned ex wife might liken you to! LOL

It's unlikely you'll get her account Isobel - she was killed in an unfortunate, some would say suspicious, boating accident...

All my poems are going to be given the one title from now on: Baetylus, Or The Couchsurfer's Crick Or Previous Rainwear Made From Husbands' Lungs.

Surely, Hatta, you mean ex-macs from ex’s lungfish? The latter also being known as salamanderfish (but, what’s in a title?), derived from a Billingsgate marketing exhortation, perhaps?

I have a haiku whose title has more than 17 syllables...

too little title leaves nothing to the imagination...